Rate of stupid criminals high too

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The Chronicle's story "Police shooting rate high" Thursday did not cover every aspect of why five people have been shot by police here -- four fatally -- in the past year. No single story can cover every angle.

The story merely took note of the incidents -- and the fact that Augusta seems to have had more than its share of them of late.

There will be more reporting in the weeks to come.

The truth is, the entire community should be asking questions -- and not just about the conduct of our sheriff's deputies. Consider: In four of the five cases, officers were found to be justified; the fifth case, which happened only Tuesday night, is still under investigation.

In two of the cases, an innocent person -- a child in one, a woman in another -- had a knife to the throat, and may have been saved by deputies from being killed.

That's not merely justified. That's heroic.

In one case, it was an armed robber who was killed. In the other two cases, suspects were attempting to flee police and reportedly put officers in danger.

So maybe the rate of really stupid criminals is high here, too.

Moreover, it must be said: There have been no allegations that any of the people shot by police were in any way innocent. Fact is, several of them had extensive or at least troubling records.

Much has been made of the fact that the police shooting rate per capita is higher here than in Los Angeles or New York. Statistically, does that mean much of anything? In a much smaller pool, it doesn't take too many incidents to raise the "per capita" of anything.

Perhaps these situations don't come up as often in big cities because officers can't be there as quickly -- and may not be able to intervene and save an innocent life.

Moreover, as experts said in the Thursday story, the number of incidents is out of context unless you look at the circumstances of each case. "The number alone is high, but that doesn't mean there's a problem," said Geoffrey Alpert, professor of criminology at the University of South Carolina.

Still, no rock should be left unturned. In the weeks ahead, we should learn more about officer training and rules of engagement. Questions should also be asked about the behavior of those shot by deputies. What led up to each incident? Why didn't they obey lawful commands from uniformed officers?

The stark reality is that you have to go miles out of your way toward Stupid Town to be shot by an officer of the law. So far, we've not heard of any Eagle Scouts being taken down while pledging allegiance to the flag.

What possesses people to flout the law and brazenly take on armed officers as these folks have? Questioning authority is one thing; daring it to shoot you is quite another. And if they take on a sheriff's deputy this way, what would they do to an unarmed civilian?

If the community asks these types of questions, we're likely to find a number of reasons: lack of parenting, lack of education, lack of morals, lack of hope, lack of caring. And drugs. Lots of drugs.

There's not much the sheriff's department can do about the parenting, the education, the morals and the like.

As for the drugs and thugs, the good guys with the guns are the best thing we've got going.

Comments (39) Add comment
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jaschild
9
Points
jaschild 11/20/09 - 04:36 am
0
0
what led to each incident?

what led to each incident? probably at least one time the following phrase was uttered by a police officer: "Stop or I'll shoot." next, a perp was ventilated. then, an article is written by a newspaper to promote circulation. in this article, the insinuation that something is amiss brings more opiners such as myself into the fold. since we're in Augusta, it also brings in the resident idiots - such as justus4 - who dont' share opinions as much as blast their waves of hate-filled garbage onto the page. the cycle continues; pull my strings again, ACES...(bone)

Riverman1
90818
Points
Riverman1 11/20/09 - 04:58 am
0
0
For the safety of the

For the safety of the officers and public, Richmond Cty should follow the policy of Columbia Cty. Officers are instructed in the policy manual to never fire into a vehicle or place themselves in a position where a vehicle could harm them. Adopting such a policy would make everyone a lot safer.

Asitisinaug
3
Points
Asitisinaug 11/20/09 - 04:59 am
0
0
These incidents listed above

These incidents listed above were more than justified, as stated, two of the incidents actually saved those who were asking for help from the police and they shot the attacker. The armed robber at Captain D's was robbing a store with a gun to the head of a manager and employee and failed to drop it when pointing it at a deputy - of course all of these idiot thugs were shot. Justus asks what was their race? Frankly we should care less and I certainly do because in this recent case, where the guy was white, I still am positive the officers did right by the community and their training. Justus asks why so many black men were killed when he should be asking how to get so many black men to stop committing violent crimes, holding knives to their wives throats, robbing stores with guns, trying to run over police officers while peddling their drugs, etc. but all he and many in the black community care about is trying to blame the police/ How about taking a pro-active approach to trying to stop crime and since the majority in our area is committed by young black males, lets start there very agressively to include pastors, schools, etc. and teach responsibility for their actions.

johnston.cliff
2
Points
johnston.cliff 11/20/09 - 05:04 am
0
0
Stupid is a very important

Stupid is a very important part of the Augusta area. Without it, we wouldn't have our subsidy issues or our County Commission issues. We're finally taking care of the county school issues, but before Dr. Bedden, stupid ruled there too. (it's still part of that fight) Trying to eradicate the stupid from our area is going to take a city-wide effort. The stupid infused can't be carried on this effort, they'll have to choose to make the effort to kick the stupid habit.

Asitisinaug
3
Points
Asitisinaug 11/20/09 - 05:05 am
0
0
Our deputies are doing a

Our deputies are doing a great job and should be thanked by everyone for all they have done to protect us. These split second reactionary decisions were reaaction to what the criminals were doing, its not like they went looking to shoot anyone. If criminals STOP when directed to do so or just weren't committing violent and felenious crimes to begin with, they wouldn't be in these situations. Even so, they were all offered an opportunity to drop a weapon or stop their vehicles, etc. but in each of these cases they failed to do so and that resulted in the officers following their training and shooting to stop which is exactly what they should do. If they fail to act, then these criminals may have killed them or their victims or for the ones in vehicles, driven off speeding and driving wreckless and placed many within our community in jeopardy or even killed innocent persons or the officers protecting us. That being said, we should come up with funds as most other counties have to assist our deputies with college degrees, higher salaries to keep those with more training here longer, a longer police academy and FTO training and more opportunities to go to classes, etc.

Asitisinaug
3
Points
Asitisinaug 11/20/09 - 05:11 am
0
0
And, finally, we do need

And, finally, we do need other options within our area for our deputies such as tasers on all deputies, readily available weapons with rubber bullets that could be used for criminals in certain situations where they are wielding a knife since now the only option for the deputy is to shoot his weapon. Additional bean bag guns, etc. again for certain situations. Many of these larger departments discussed in the origional article have 2 officers per vehicle, far more training hours, and more readily available choices of weapons for various situations. Many also have minimum requirements to include at least a 2 year college degree (not that it makes all officers better) but college certainly has its good points and they are able to retain good officers who have a lot of training and experience because they offer good pay and job benefits. The RCSO pays the lowest salaries in the area, has the worst benefits, allows for very little extra training and opportuinites to go to POST classes once on duty due to budget constraints, etc. Our deputies WANT all the training and options we can provide them with not to have to fire their weapons but in most cases, it is the criminal who decides

Riverman1
90818
Points
Riverman1 11/20/09 - 05:16 am
0
0
Interesting that these

Interesting that these plainclothes officers took the time to put on yellow raincoats that have "police" written on the back before attempting the arrest as they said they did.

southernguy08
532
Points
southernguy08 11/20/09 - 06:01 am
0
0
Where is JUSTUS, CAIN, RCR,
Unpublished

Where is JUSTUS, CAIN, RCR, and TECH screaming that criminal have a constitutional right to be stupid? I see RIVERMAN wants to say that but is too cs to come right out and say it.

overburdened_taxpayer
117
Points
overburdened_taxpayer 11/20/09 - 06:05 am
0
0
Riverman1 - the policy in

Riverman1 - the policy in Columbia County has changed. I think it is that deputies are highly encouraged not to fire at moving vehicles but the final decision is left to the deputy to decide based on circumstances in that unique incident.

SoonerorLater
0
Points
SoonerorLater 11/20/09 - 06:12 am
0
0
Bleeding hearts have sympathy

Bleeding hearts have sympathy for criminals who only take from society, ruin it with spreading of their crime and drugs, and people talk about the rights of these POS's. It is the community's constitutional right to have a safe community to live in, and anyone who denies them of this right should be dealt with properly. They are a drain on society and do not add value to quality of life, but take value away by making the community crime ridden. Good riddance to these people, they get what they deserve.

corgimom
36833
Points
corgimom 11/20/09 - 06:31 am
0
0
Some people act as if he was

Some people act as if he was a nice young man just going down to the Quick Stop for a Coke. He left his home to evade the police, and the police knew he had guns. Hey, if the cops got a search warrant for my house, and found drugs, I would know that if I didn't turn myself in, they would be looking for me and it wouldn't be good. He brought this all on himself.

Little Lamb
48022
Points
Little Lamb 11/20/09 - 09:41 am
0
0
Riverman's first post needs

Riverman's first post needs some clarification. It is impossible for a police officer NEVER to place himself in a position where a vehicle could harm him. Vehicles have steering wheels and accelerators so they can be quite handy at running someone down.

marley
0
Points
marley 11/20/09 - 10:22 am
0
0
Riverman1 - the jackets are

Riverman1 - the jackets are called RAID jackets not Rain. they are black with large yellow writing across the front stating Sheriff's Dept. and also on the back. As stated from previous news stories and interviews with the girlfriend. Mr. Nester knew exactly who those deputies were and didn't want to go to jail.

FedupwithAUG
0
Points
FedupwithAUG 11/20/09 - 11:07 am
0
0
Hold on I'm going to go run

Hold on I'm going to go run out into traffic then shoot the person about to hit me because they are about to cause bodily harm. That seems to be the mentality of the current police procedure. I think that is Riverman's point here.

FedupwithAUG
0
Points
FedupwithAUG 11/20/09 - 11:18 am
0
0
Still don't understand why a

Still don't understand why a marked police car was not used to pull in behind the guy to prevent escape. They obviously drove by in their unmarked cars and decided to apprehend. They put on a black jacket and ran toward the victim. Sure it had something police related on the front but their guns were drawn. I'm sure they were holding their guns with both hands as they ran. This guy probably couldn't read the message on the jacket with that stance. Then one of then puts him self in a situation that can cause his own bodily harm and they shoot. You know you're innocent until proven guilty in this country.

AWyld1
3
Points
AWyld1 11/20/09 - 11:21 am
0
0
Fedup his own g/f stated he

Fedup his own g/f stated he knew they were there to arrest him. Stop with the conspiracy crap. He was a fleeing felon he put himself in that position.

eachoneteachone
0
Points
eachoneteachone 11/20/09 - 11:41 am
0
0
RCSD is the best!!!!!!!

RCSD is the best!!!!!!!

eachoneteachone
0
Points
eachoneteachone 11/20/09 - 11:42 am
0
0
I think that we all are

I think that we all are uncomfortable being surrounded by criminals. We are happy when they get what they deserve. These few shootings, in a small way, make up for the impotence that has fallen on Georgias' death penalty. Further we are tired of our tax dollars going to detain people who would have been executed thirty years ago, in the good old days! Now that we have video surveillance, DNA testing's we should proceed full steam with capital punishment. Where is our sense of right and wrong?

themaninthemirror
0
Points
themaninthemirror 11/20/09 - 12:14 pm
0
0
Hold on I'm going to go run

Hold on I'm going to go run out into traffic then shoot the person about to hit me because they are about to cause bodily harm. That seems to be the mentality of the current police procedure. Fedupwith AUG- Is that what happened? Was the perp riding down the road when the police jumped out in front of him and then shot because they thought he was going to run over them. I can not believe the audacity of such a conclusion. Maybe you should just go on out and play in the middle of Washington Road.

fishman960
1502
Points
fishman960 11/20/09 - 12:33 pm
0
0
ACES states that they will do

ACES states that they will do more reporting and investigating. As I posted yesterday, I witnessed the whole Captain D's incident. I cannot speak on the latest incident, however I am more than willing to talk about the D's incident. ACES, you have my e-mail address. Feel free to contact me with any questions you may have, and again let me state that I am very fortunate that I am alive today thanks to the R.C.S.D.

storiesihaveread
358
Points
storiesihaveread 11/20/09 - 12:59 pm
0
0
My son is planning on

My son is planning on entering the Law Enforcement field. His goal though is start out with GSP, work his way though the ranks of GBI , then he is shooting for something Federal. Even though he will not be a road patrol deputy I will still worry about him. The police here need to start having double patrols. At times it can take minutes if a deputy is in a situation where he will need backup.

butler123
1
Points
butler123 11/20/09 - 01:08 pm
0
0
The question we need to be

The question we need to be asking is why we have such a high crime rate for a city this small?

andywarhol
0
Points
andywarhol 11/20/09 - 01:14 pm
0
0
This reminds me of a case I

This reminds me of a case I saw on tv where two cops busted about 6-8 people in an empty apartment near their projects. They all had priors, were in possession of firearms, drugs w/ scales, and a known prostitute. The family and one of thier mother came out all upset with the police. One family was trying to start a riot and get the hood fired up with the police. The mother was crying and mad at the police for having her son face down on the ground w/ cuffs on. Not one of the people saw anything wrong with the actions of these individuals. THE POLICE WERE THE BAD GUYS. Mama knew her son was dealin and using, but there was nothing wrong with that. The police were bad because they caught him. This is a sad and endless cycle.

baronvonreich
0
Points
baronvonreich 11/20/09 - 02:21 pm
0
0
butler123 it might have

butler123 it might have something to do with demographics

TakeAstand
13
Points
TakeAstand 11/20/09 - 02:58 pm
0
0
Yep andy, way to many people

Yep andy, way to many people make excuses for these lowlife criminals, then you have all the bleeding hearts who do not allow them to be punished appropriately causing a high rate of repeat offenders and no deterrance what so ever for new ones!

justus4
111
Points
justus4 11/20/09 - 04:02 pm
0
0
...been reading the comments
Unpublished

...been reading the comments and the dishonesty and inconsistency is colossal (it means big) and here is why: The Elmore shooting was roundly condemned by the minority community, but the non-minority community was solidly behind the officers. What is different about this case? Same set of facts, i.e. bad guy, selling drugs, used vehicle as weapon, shot & killed by police, investigation ruled "appropiate acts by police", so what is fueling this appearance of luke-warm support for the officers and questions about police operating procedures? Of course, ol' justus knows those answers, but fear the comments will be removed - if stated. Something is brewing...

Riverman1
90818
Points
Riverman1 11/20/09 - 04:08 pm
0
0
First of all, in this case,

First of all, in this case, I'll take the officers' word until something else comes up. I'll also ask questions. The Columbia Cty directive to their deputies is to avoid these situations. Sure, there can always be incidents where they are placed in harms way no matter their instructions and attempts to stay away from moving cars and potential injury. I have no idea what needs clarification here. About the RAID jackets...okay, I'll buy that, but I thought they were originally described as rain jackets. I could be wrong on that...So the officers knew they would be in a situation where they had to let the bad guy know they were officers...right? But they never asked for uniformed officers and they donned the jackets before somewhere (where?) and drove in those jackets to the house. Or did they change right in front of the house? The jackets are kept in the trunk or where? The witnesses saw them wearing these jackets?

baronvonreich
0
Points
baronvonreich 11/20/09 - 04:12 pm
0
0
So a black getting shot is

So a black getting shot is roundly condemned in the black community and a white getting shot leads to a rational debate by the white community with minimal to no input from the black community. Sounds like one community has some objectivity and critical thinking skills while the other one does not and only looks to play the race card.

Riverman1
90818
Points
Riverman1 11/20/09 - 04:19 pm
0
0
Baron, I don't know about

Baron, I don't know about that, but, as a white conservative, I raised Cain over the Elmore shooting because I believe it was unjusttified, but I backed the police totally in all the others until this one and now I'm only asking questions so far.

55 F-100
1
Points
55 F-100 11/20/09 - 04:27 pm
0
0
Well, justus, the reason that

Well, justus, the reason that Elmore's case got more attention was by virtue of the location, as well as the fact that Elmore had been ordered by the court to stay off of that property. Combine that with the crowd's public distrust of the LEO's, and the video evidence, and scrutiny escalates, and the conduct of the officers was validated by the video evidence. But at the end of the day, the results were identical.....two career criminal drug slinging, drug taking maggots taking the eternal dirt nap, because of their criminal conduct in attempting to injure/kill armed LEO's with their vehicles......and the world is a better place without them.

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