Deception lies with the pro-lifers

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Gail Sikes ("Pro-lifers stand for more than children," July 8) should realize broader truths beyond her own self-defined ones. "Love of all mankind" and "protection of all human beings from fertilization until natural death" are empty shibboleths in this instance, because pro-lifers do not, in effect, practice the first one, and it would seem that even God does not practice the second one.

Pro-lifers believe they have superior insight, and assert that an unconscious fetus, or mass of embryonic tissue, is a person. They believe their irrational viewpoint is unquestionable because they know better. They further believe the imposition of a personal ideology on others is an act of love. Humans and animals share the same biology. Yet if I were to insist that a sheep embryo is a lamb, and that killing said embryo equates with the slaughter of an innocent lamb that eats, breathes and feels pain, people would think me insane. In fact, it is illustrative of the logic of pro-lifers.

At least one-third of all conceptions end in spontaneous abortion usually because of fetal defects. That makes God the biggest abortionist of all.

Most women who were not coerced and feel the decision was right for them experience no post abortion trauma. The women who feel traumatized are mainly victims of the very self-appointed moralists and crusaders who claim to have women's best interests at heart. They, along with patriarchal, controlling religions that subjugate women, inflict untold suffering by engendering guilt, depression and other useless emotions in those who should be free to determine their destinies without interference from self-righteous busybodies.

Planned Parenthood does not deceive or deny facts. Deception is the specialty of pro-lifers with their hysterical hogwash and calls for governmental control over an intensely private matter, all in the name of love.

Joni Ellsworth, North Augusta S.C.

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willistontownsc
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willistontownsc 07/22/08 - 03:54 pm
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Yeah Patricia and all of the

Yeah Patricia and all of the "pro-life" posters don't seem to think of what coat hangers were really used for prior to Roe. Nor do they seem to think that the woman being slaughtered by etopic pregnancy or childbirth should have a right to live, either.

willistontownsc
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willistontownsc 07/22/08 - 03:58 pm
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weekapaug05, women don't have

weekapaug05, women don't have much control over their lives, let alone their bodies thanks to the big government conservatives and the evil patriarchy.

willistontownsc
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willistontownsc 07/22/08 - 04:00 pm
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wrong, greenjacket. forced

wrong, greenjacket. forced pregnancy is rape. and slavery to boot. That is why the SCOTUS ruled like they did on 01/22/1973.

weekapaug05
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weekapaug05 07/22/08 - 04:01 pm
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ishefa, people are against

ishefa, people are against public programs because they think that the govt. doesn't need to tell them how to spend their money that they earned. There are plenty of non-profits out there that do the same things these public programs you speak of do and many people donate money to them because it's the right thing to do, not because big brother forced them to do it. What's wrong with being pro-nuke? It's a clean, effecient, and cheep from of power and is safe. Name me one melt down that has taken place in a nuke plant in the US.

weekapaug05
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weekapaug05 07/22/08 - 04:01 pm
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what part of your life do you

what part of your life do you not have control of?

willistontownsc
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willistontownsc 07/22/08 - 04:03 pm
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We don't need nuclear power

We don't need nuclear power anywhere on Planet Earth! Chernobyl is why.

truthisouttherestill
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truthisouttherestill 07/22/08 - 04:03 pm
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no one is forcing women to

no one is forcing women to keep the children......there are couples waiting to adopt infants........one article i read said in 2000 the us had approx 1.3 million abortions while there were an estimated 2 million couples waiting to adopt.......there are alternatives......including not laying on their backs in the first place

ishefa
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ishefa 07/22/08 - 04:03 pm
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greenjacket: Did it ever

greenjacket:

Did it ever ocurr to you that not everyone in this nation is Christian, or do they desire to be, let alone be harassed by Christian " arrogance and "self-rightousness?

Bizarro
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Bizarro 07/22/08 - 04:05 pm
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Personally I'm against

Personally I'm against abortion and capital punishment but as a matter of law I support both. A fetus is a human being by all biological and evolutionary criteria, but it is not a legal person. As such abortion does kill a human being but it is not illegal nor a legal person so it is not murder. It is not know if a fetus at 28 weeks does feel pain, but it is known that they do respond to noxious stimuli. The thalamic pathways in the brain aren't functional till 30 weeks so likely there is no conscious pain. Abortion is a medical procedure and should be legal, but it seems the practice is abused. I remember a friend of mine knocked up the same girl three times and paid for three abortions. Pretty dang stupid on both parts as both were educated and priviledged so it seems an abuse.

willistontownsc
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willistontownsc 07/22/08 - 04:05 pm
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john, while none of the

john, while none of the things you listed at 15:01 happens currently, if you and the other big government conservatives get your way, all of these things will be legal again here in America.

truthisouttherestill
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truthisouttherestill 07/22/08 - 04:10 pm
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to say that at 28 weeks a

to say that at 28 weeks a fetus feels no pain is a big one pro-choice people like to throw out.......but until we can abort a baby and then find a way to bring it back and ask it how can you totally prove that........and what about the ones aborted later than that.

weekapaug05
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weekapaug05 07/22/08 - 04:12 pm
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ishefa, what's christianity

ishefa, what's christianity have to do with it when really it's morality between members of a species. Athiest will tell you that they have morals and they believe in no god.

Georgiais1
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Georgiais1 07/22/08 - 04:28 pm
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You got to rember Willingston

You got to rember Willingston voted for Marion Williams...Explains a lot about her choices and Joni's....Get help

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Dan White 07/22/08 - 04:30 pm
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Yes, ishefa, I am fully aware

Yes, ishefa, I am fully aware that the USA is not a Christian nation, but there are perhaps a few Christians in here to whom the post was for. I am also aware that some Christians are rude, obnoxious, and self-righteous, but such a broad stroke of condemnation is not fair to those who try and follow Christ and his great commandments to love one another and love God with all your heart soul and mind.

Bizarro
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Bizarro 07/22/08 - 04:34 pm
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Truthisouththerestill that is

Truthisouththerestill that is a fallacious argument. Anatomically and neurophysiologically the brain works a specific way. If the anatomical connections aren't made nor functional (and the evidence indicates such) then they won't feel conscious pain. Without the thalamic connections to the brain sensory input is not in a readable form for the brain to decipher. There are publications that argue that fetuses can feel pain, but recent reviews in JAMA and other notable journals conclude it is highly unlikely. You should be happy that is the case. It is not an argument just the facts. Just like lethal injection is not supposed to be painful either.

FallingLeaves
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FallingLeaves 07/22/08 - 05:26 pm
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I wonder what happens to the

I wonder what happens to the souls of each person that is conceived then murdered?

Bizarro
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Bizarro 07/22/08 - 05:30 pm
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That would initiate a

That would initiate a theological debate dependent on denomination. I wonder how many would be so equipped to handle the task? A similar question would be those who have lived isolated (like tribes in the Amazon) and never had contact with society to here about Christ-would they be damned or not. You can't accept Christ if you have never heard of him and similar issues.

Bizarro
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Bizarro 07/22/08 - 06:04 pm
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How idiotic is the LTE's

How idiotic is the LTE's logic about spontaneous abortion, and God is the biggest aborionist of all. What a non sequitur!!!!!People die from auto accidents, cardiac arrest, etc. God has nothing to do with it. Just like the author of the LTE is obviously brain dead, but I doubt God did that too.

SisterAbdullahX_
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SisterAbdullahX_ 07/22/08 - 06:33 pm
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dashiel , wonders how many

dashiel , wonders how many pro lifers would want to adopt these "unwanted" children. I've heard that one over and over. Well I'll bounce it right back. Obviously the Pro Choice people don't want to adopt the baby.....they just want to kill it.

farfaraway
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farfaraway 07/22/08 - 06:59 pm
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How would he feel when some

How would he feel when some one in his family was raped and got pregnant. Would he want her to keep the child. Also, would he want the young girl keep the child when her father, uncle got her pregnant. It is case by case choice. I don't believe that you should have an abortion because you got pregnant by your boyfriend. Give it up for adoption.

SisterAbdullahX_
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SisterAbdullahX_ 07/22/08 - 07:04 pm
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ladym.......Yes......in ALL

ladym.......Yes......in ALL cases.....have the child and let a loving family adopt him or her. People are in line for them. Just because a girl is unfortunate enough to be raped, is no reason for her to commit murder.

DuhJudge
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DuhJudge 07/22/08 - 08:55 pm
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Imagine yourself in your car

Imagine yourself in your car cruising down I-20. The air conditioning is on, the radio is on, the weather is calm, the sky is clear, the traffic is thin, but out of no where a pipe falls off the truck in front of you. Now it doesn't matter how close to your origin or how distant to your destination. It doesn't matter the color of your car. The pipe comes through the windshield and impales your head. It is not fair, not right, not good, but the law is at least on your side. The law doesn't give trucks the right to drop pipes on the interstate. So how does it give people the right to stick pipes into baby heads?

patriciathomas
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patriciathomas 07/22/08 - 09:59 pm
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What does it say about our

What does it say about our society that not only do a lot of people think killing babies is a "right", but our government makes everyone pay for them. That's just a little too Byzantine for me and mine.

KSL
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KSL 07/22/08 - 10:06 pm
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I'm a little out of touch. Is

I'm a little out of touch. Is the government paying for abortions? I didn't think they were.

alden
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alden 07/22/08 - 10:14 pm
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No one on welfare should be

No one on welfare should be permitted to have children. Period.

alden
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alden 07/22/08 - 10:15 pm
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That is, have any more

That is, have any more children. Period.

helpicantfindthespacebar
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helpicantfindthespacebar 07/23/08 - 12:31 am
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The pro-lifers (and the

The pro-lifers (and the government) have no business sticking their noses in someone else's uterus. Their time would be better spent helping children who have already been born, but strangely enough they don't seem to be nearly as concerned with what happens to babies once they've been delivered.

christian134
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christian134 07/23/08 - 04:26 am
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Greenjacket I can not even

Greenjacket I can not even begin to fathom why you would accuse me of treating and judging these women who have had abortions as pariahs.....You must have a need for attention in order to bolster you self-esteem on these boards but believe me when I say you are doing more harm than good with your innuendos as to my comments..I have in no way said anything that would condemn anyone...What I have said and will continue to shout is that abortion is wrong not from some man made laws but from God's laws which I know you know usurps man's...People have a chance at complete forgiveness of sins if they humbly repent and accept Jesus Christ as their one and only Savior and then and then commit the sin no more...What is so hard about that statement Greenjacket that you have a problem understanding? Abortion is wrong, abortion is murder, the person who does this is wrong but the person is free from the guilt and anguish of this sin by Christ's cleansing blood...Now that has been cleared up let us get back to the crux of the situation...Abortion is murder...Our duty is to try and teach people this fact so that others will not commit this same heinous act.

christian134
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christian134 07/23/08 - 04:34 am
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Snarky most do care what

Snarky most do care what happens after the babies are born but the powers that be will more often than not oppose adoption by a single parent, parent or parents of a difference racial makeup, and evidently more importantly the household income doesn't meet their requirements...They are the obstacles not the ones who want a child of their own. Do not blame one and approve the other unless you know exactly what you are speaking on...Again those who have the babies need to take the responsibility instead of always looking to someone else which for many seems to be the norm...

prolifepsychologist
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prolifepsychologist 07/23/08 - 09:06 am
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Some more questions for the

Some more questions for the thoughtful: Why can we tell people not to smoke, not to drive without seatbelts, not to overeat, not to take drugs, but we can't suggest that they not have sex if they want don't want to get pregnant? (Abstinence works 100% of the time--no pregnancy; no diseases.) Why does my supposed refusal to adopt a child, justify you killing one? What if a woman had a baby and when that baby was two years old, she couldn't afford her anymore and was going to abuse her? Could she kill her toddler? (BTW, most abortion-minded women would rather kill their babies than put them up for adoption. Check it out!) The Law of Biogenises: we reproduce after our own kind. The human conceptus is not a dog or cat, it is a human being. Why don't the pro-aborts just say "it is what it is" however, we believe that we have the right to take human life if we so "choose?" At least they would be honest. Finally, if abortion is a "right" when did women get that right? When they became women? So a female baby in the womb has the right to an abortion, but not the right to life? Hhhhmmm!

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