War on Christmas is real

  • Follow Letters

If the fundamental bases from which we think are faulty, our conclusions will be faulty. Shayne Felberg’s letter “There’s no war on Christmas” (Dec. 4) is a good example. After stating there is no war on Christmas, she proceeds to call Christmas a myth.

Then she contradicts herself even more by saying that Christmas should not be celebrated in public institutions such as schools or by governments – yet these two institutions are doing much of the battling against Christmas.

The First Amendment to the Constitution reads: “Congress shall make no law (get it, no law) respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof.” The statement is clear! But the liberal judges who passed this rule of “church and state” were confused as to what this statement meant, because their fundamental basic thinking was faulty – or was it a personal agenda they were following, like attacking Christians and perhaps Christmas? Forbidding the manger scene comes to mind.

Getting back to Christmas, if it is a myth then the whole Jewish nation is a myth, because the story of Christmas began in its history when God promised them a Messiah would come, and He is Yeshua.

As far as America being a Christian nation, look up the preambles of several states’ constitutions and you will find that the people give thanks to God for His blessing upon their states.

Marry Christmas, everyone.

Gil Ward

Evans

Comments (46) Add comment
ADVISORY: Users are solely responsible for opinions they post here and for following agreed-upon rules of civility. Posts and comments do not reflect the views of this site. Posts and comments are automatically checked for inappropriate language, but readers might find some comments offensive or inaccurate. If you believe a comment violates our rules, click the "Flag as offensive" link below the comment.
swcohen
586
Points
swcohen 12/07/11 - 06:56 am
0
0
As the forum's token Jewish

As the forum's token Jewish guy, I should weigh in. Jews don't have any quarrel with Christmas, but we sure don't celebrate it. Christians celebrate Christmas, as it is a Christian holiday. To me, it's just a quiet day off. When I was little, I remember my dad would work on Christmas eve so his Gentile employees could have th day off. I always take callout on Christmas so my Gentile coworkers won't bave to spend their holiday restoring equipment to service.

Let's suppose that you lived in a predominantly Jewish city, and everybody took off for Rosh Hashana or Yom Kippur. You're off as well, and although you have nothing against Judaism, you sure won't be spending those days in Temple. You'll just take the day off and relax. That's how we spend Christmas. So enjoy your holiday, and let's have no more talk of "war."

Oh, I do wish folks Merry Christmas. It's the neighborly thing to do.

OJP
6634
Points
OJP 12/07/11 - 08:58 am
0
0
InChristLove, It wouldn't be

InChristLove,

It wouldn't be called "Christmas" but the celebration would continue and would most likely appear extremely similar to today's Christmas.

Before the Christians co-opted this holiday, it was called Saturnalia.

So, no, Christ is not the reason for the season. Without his existence, humans would still celebrate the Winter Solstice, as we have for millenia. Facts are facts.

OJP

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 10:09 am
0
0
OJP, your facts are not facts

OJP, your facts are not facts but only opinion. If Christ has not been born to die for the forgiveness of our sins, then most likely none of us would be here, so there would be no Winter Solstice or Christmas to celebrate. Because of our sinful nature, it is highly reasonable to assume that God would have wiped human existence off the face of the earth as He did in the days of Noah and started over again.

Christ may not be the reason you celebrate this time of year, but it is most definitely the reason I and other Christians celebrate. You can celebrate Winter Solstice but IMO you can not celebrate Christmas without CHRIST.

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 10:23 am
0
0
" Roman pagans first

" Roman pagans first introduced the holiday of Saturnalia, a week long period of lawlessness celebrated between December 17-25. During this period, Roman courts were closed, and Roman law dictated that no one could be punished for damaging property or injuring people during the weeklong celebration. The festival began when Roman authorities chose “an enemy of the Roman people” to represent the “Lord of Misrule.” Each Roman community selected a victim whom they forced to indulge in food and other physical pleasures throughout the week. At the festival’s conclusion, December 25th, Roman authorities believed they were destroying the forces of darkness by brutally murdering this innocent man or woman."

http://www.simpletoremember.com/vitals/Christmas_TheRealStory.htm

Sounds like a wonderful event to celebrate (NOT).

burninater
9583
Points
burninater 12/07/11 - 10:31 am
0
0
Hey, guess what? Christmas is

Hey, guess what? Christmas is happening this year. Just like it did every other year of this "war".

OJP
6634
Points
OJP 12/07/11 - 10:44 am
0
0
InChristLove, Clearly we're

InChristLove,

Clearly we're going to disagree whether the planet would still exist had Jesus never been born. But, sure, I'll admit that if Christians are correct and Jesus had not died for our sins, the planet might have been destroyed by God - if you admit that if Christians are not correct and Jesus had not been born, the Winter Solstice would still be celebrated by humans worldwide.

And you can definitely celebrate Christmas without Christ. I do it every year.

OJP

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 11:31 am
0
0
Well OJP, I guess we will

Well OJP, I guess we will have to agree to disagree because I could never admit that my Christian faith/belief is wrong and to say that if Jesus was never born the Winter Solstice would still be celebrated by humans makes as much sense as saying if you hadn't been born we'd still be having this conversation.......does not make logical sense at all.

OJP, although you can most certainly celebrate on December 25th and throughout the month. The term Christmas or "Christ Mass" was established by the Christian church to disconnect the holiday and it's customs from that of the pagans, to celebrate the birth of Christ. You may celebrate with family and friends, decorate, exchange gifts, eat, drink and be merry just as the pagans did thousands of years ago but in order to actually celebrate "Christ Mass" it has to include Christ. Just as a side note, during all your celebrating, you may think you are doing it without Christ but actually He is always there whether you acknowledge Him or not.

OJP
6634
Points
OJP 12/07/11 - 01:41 pm
0
0
InChristLove, I questioned

InChristLove,

I questioned whether I'd make any inroads with our joint hypotheticals... the difference between our abilities there parallels the difference between religious fundamentalists and everyone else: acknowledgment that you are not omniscient. I'm extremely thankful I am able to entertain hypotheticals, and even more thankful that I don't live in a country run by those who KNOW their God is the true God (we've seen how well that can turn out).

And your semantic point is hardly relevant, unless you admit to honoring Thor every Thursday (or attending Catholic Mass on Christmas for that matter). The origins of words do not necessarily dictate their current definitions.

OJP

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 02:28 pm
0
0
OJP, I am not oppose to

OJP, I am not oppose to hypotheticals and normally can entertain different scenarios, but in your case the hypothetical you suggested is not possible for me to even consider. So you now judge my abilities because I don’t agree with you? Have I questioned your abilities because your belief is different than mine? I do not believe I ever claimed to be omniscient and what does the god Thor have to do with anything? You assume to know what my religious affiliation is? Where have I discuss what my beliefs are except concerning the birth of Jesus Christ and Christmas? Can I now claim you are not omniscient?

swcohen
586
Points
swcohen 12/07/11 - 02:55 pm
0
0
Forgive my ignorance... and

Forgive my ignorance... and my obvious attempt to change the subject... But I never could figure out what the significance of decorated trees were. I never had one... except at various workplaces. I never asked until now. Must be this "war" thing making me bold.

So, what's the tree mean?

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 03:01 pm
0
0
OJP, I spent some time

OJP, I spent some time reading and rereading your comment, several times exactly, because I wanted to make sure I understood the purpose of your comment. I find your wording to be telling of your true intent and purpose.

inroad - an advance or penetration often at the expense of someone or something. A sudden or hostile incursion.

If this was your intent, then I am thankful is was not successful. My point was that from a Christian standpoint, Christmas is (or should be) all about Christ. That was the intent of early Christians and still is today. The season or celebration was purposely called Christmas and is the celebration of the birth of Christ. You can claim that the original word does not necessarily dictate it's current definition and for those who leave Christ out of it, I would have to agree with you on that but for Christians who celebrate Christmas, the meaning has never changed.

You may disagree with that and that is okay but please, refrain from the innuendos or polite insults, and just speak frankly. When I stated we would have to agree to disagree, I suppose that was just wishful thinking. If you view me as a religious fundamentalists that is your opinion, but I make no judgement concerning your abilities or character, it would be nice if you did the same.

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 03:28 pm
0
0
swcohen, I'm sure you will

swcohen, I'm sure you will find several differences of opinions on the meaning of the Christmas tree but IMO this opinion sort of sums it up.

Usually Christmas trees are fir trees, evergreens, which do not die, fade away, or lose their needles in the wintertime. In a sense representing the immortality of the resurrected Christ. Of course the tree is usually decorated with a star (Star of David) or an angel (who announced the birth of Christ).

Originally the lights used were candles and were meant to symbolize Christ’s love and the gift of eternal life. The candles provided light and warmth as the candle consumed themselvesf, the wax. This process came to symbolize Jesus and His sacrifice by giving His own life substance, the purpose of which He was born

OJP
6634
Points
OJP 12/07/11 - 03:30 pm
0
0
InChristLove, If you cannot

InChristLove,

If you cannot even entertain the notion that your religious beliefs might be wrong, that makes you a fundamentalist (in my opinion). No belief can be granted that level of deference without omniscience. I personally think periodically questioning such beliefs is healthy, if for no other reason than to strengthen the arguments in their favor. (I, for instance, re-read Richard Dawkins' "The God Delusion" every year or so.)

And, no, I had no ill-intent when I chose "inroads" - until now I thought it had a much milder definition (although the proper definition works regarding your refusal to admit even the remotest possibility of error, even hypothetically).

Taking Christ out of Christmas would - again - certainly change the holiday for Christians. But - again - that is not my point. My point is that removing Christ from the holiday leaves most of it intact from a non-Christian perspective. I can still put up a tree, exchange gifts, adorn my house with lights, enjoy a feast, get together with friends and family, enjoy a Yule log, kiss under mistletoe, etc., without acknowledging Christ and absolutely nothing about those traditions would change (because they either pre-date Christianity or were developed independently of Christianity).

Finally, Thor is Thursday's namesake (i.e., Thor's Day). Claiming that Christmas is Christian simply because it has the name "Christ" in it is similar to claiming Thursday is pagan simply because it has the name "Thor" in it.

OJP

Jane18
12332
Points
Jane18 12/07/11 - 03:32 pm
0
0
A war? Oh yes, especially in

A war? Oh yes, especially in words! That's because no one can back up with certainty what is being said, it is a believing or not believing thing..... Some of us know that we DO know, some because of what they have read, some because it is what they have heard all their lives, some because of false teachers, and those that that just do not believe----in anything. > I would like to ask swcohen, to whom are you speaking of when you say gentile? A gentile(goy to you) is a heathen, someone that does not know of GOD or much less believe in HIM. Surely you do not believe that the Jewish people are the only people of Israel. Maybe (of) the little country of Israel, but, not of the entire family of Jacob(name change made by GOD to Israel, yiz-ra-el). Judah and Benjamin are the two tribes that make up Israel(the country which is the House of Judah),so, where are the other ten tribes(House of Israel) that were to be scattered? How about Europe and eventually to places like Canada, and surprise---to this youngest and most blessed country on earth! I call myself an Israelite sw, so please do not call any of us a gentile unless you know for sure who you are talking about. > JESUS had it correct when HE said, " A prophet is without honor among His people", did HE not?

OJP
6634
Points
OJP 12/07/11 - 03:42 pm
0
0
InChristLove, I agree with

InChristLove,

I agree with you about the general symbolism of evergreens. They have been used as symbols of endurance through the winter in many cultures.

OJP

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 03:57 pm
0
0
If that makes me a

If that makes me a fundamentalist, then so be it, but I can not question the existance of God any more than I can question the existance of my parents or my siblings. There is no doubt in my mind that He exists, so what would be the purpose of questioning it?

If you have to read and reread something to reaffirm that what you knew in the first place to be so, then I'd say you didn't believe what you thought you believed in the first place. Truth does not need reaffirmation.

Christians read and study the Bible, not to reaffirm their belief but to gain knowledge of the One whom they have always believed in from the time they were spiritually born.

As for explanation of Thursday and Thor, I see your point, disagree but understand your viewpoint.

swcohen
586
Points
swcohen 12/07/11 - 04:03 pm
0
0
I meant no offence when I

I meant no offence when I used the term "Gentile." that's just a nice term for anybody who isn't Jewish, be they Christian, Muslim, Hindu, whatever.
I wouldn't rankle feathers by saying "not of TheTribe..." ;^)

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 04:21 pm
0
0
Getting back to the original

Getting back to the original topic of the letter, Christmas was established by Christians to replace the pagan celebration in the hope of converting pagans to Christianity. It is true, pagans were celebration this time of year long before, so if you chose not to include Christ in your celebration, then maybe those should go back to the pagan name of celebrating and those who believe in Christ and the purpose of celebrating Christmas can continue to call it "Christ" mass. As for "war", personally there will always be conflict between the spiritual realm and the worldly realm. Always have been and always will be until the return of Christ. We just have to be patient until the battle is won.

OJP
6634
Points
OJP 12/07/11 - 04:59 pm
0
0
InChristLove, Would you

InChristLove,

Would you forego using "Thursday" and come up with a new name for that day of the week if adherents of Thor's religion suggested you do so? And would you remove these words from your vocabulary if believers in the Greek gods suggested you do so: http://www.need.org/needpdf/GreekWords.pdf ?

I don't see why you should, and I don't see why non-Christians should rename Christmas either.

OJP

ETA: And, FYI, Easter is named after a pagan god...

InChristLove
22473
Points
InChristLove 12/07/11 - 05:05 pm
0
0
OJP, give it a rest. It was

OJP, give it a rest. It was only an off the shoulder comment. Leave it at that.

Back to Top

Search Augusta jobs