There's no war on Christmas

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The war on Christmas has begun – at least in the minds of those who believe this myth as much as they believe the myth about the holiday itself. All it takes for some is to see the words “holiday” or “Xmas” on a sign – and there it is, proof that “political correctness” is busy taking Christ out of Christmas.

There is no war on Christmas. There is a “war” (a lousy word for it) on behalf of reason and inclusiveness. You are as free as you have ever been to celebrate in your heart, your mind, your home and in public.

No one I know is offended by you celebrating it. I’m agnostic, which means I know a whole lot of people who aren’t Christians. And I know no one who would be offended by someone saying “Merry Christmas” to him or her. Nor do I know any atheist, agnostic, Jew, etc., who insists on saying “Happy Holidays” instead of “Merry Christmas” because he is at war with Christmas. He just might not know what holiday you celebrate.

That brings me to what the defenders of Christmas in this great “war” never seem to understand:

We live in a diverse nation in which people come from all kinds of traditions and religions, and celebrate all kinds of different holidays. That – with the First Amendment – is why the only celebration of Christmas that is offensive is when it is done by public institutions such as schools or governments, which have no business celebrating any religious holiday.

We are not now, and have never been, “a Christian nation.” We are a nation dedicated to the proposition that religion has no place in government – and that has nothing to do with any mythical war on Christmas.

Shayne Felberg

Augusta

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Fundamental_Arminian
1849
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Fundamental_Arminian 12/03/11 - 11:50 pm
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"We live in a diverse nation

"We live in a diverse nation in which people come from all kinds of traditions and religions, and celebrate all kinds of different holidays" (Shayne Felberg).

If our nation were truly diverse, all holiday traditions would be allowed to shine through during this season. Gifts and decorations would be clearly labeled so that it would be plain what is meant for Christmas, Chanukkah, or Kwanzaa.

Instead, trees, cards, and decorations intended for Christmas are advertized as holiday trees, cards, and decorations. But decorations, etc. intended for Chanukkah or Kwanzaa aren't advertized that way. Even Christians who don't go around looking for a fight can't help noticing the unfairness. Besides, any salesperson with the slightest aptitude for customer relations can figure out what type of greeting to give to customers depending on whether they buy something for Christmas, Chanukkah, or Kwanzaa.

As a customer, I vote with my business. I buy from the stores that sell Christmas stuff, not from those that sell holiday stuff. And I'm not bothered to see Chanukkah and Kwanzaa stuff sold where Christmas stuff is.

Jane18
12332
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Jane18 12/04/11 - 10:32 am
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There is no way to get any

There is no way to get any thing across to Shayne. People do not waste your words and reasonings on him. When he said he is agnostic(believes it impossible to know if GOD exists), that says it all! The "war" is against CHRISTianity, not December 25th.

seenitB4
87396
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seenitB4 12/04/11 - 11:43 am
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Merry Christmas--Happy

Merry Christmas--Happy Holidays & Happy New Year!

MyNameIsPat
0
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MyNameIsPat 12/04/11 - 11:44 am
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I think what Shayne is saying

I think what Shayne is saying is completely reasonable...and Fundamental_Arminian has a fantastic observation. They use Christian symbols and simply relabel them as "holiday" symbols. Totally valid observation. I never really thought that way about it! As an athesist (believes "god" does not exist), frankly I think we should be as inclusive as possible. Not for political correctness but to understand the beliefs of others. Maybe if we were all more openminded and considerate of those with other beliefs not only would we appear less ignorant, but perhaps there would less hate and hostility in the world. NEWS FLASH!! Christians aren't the only ones living on this planet. And Jane18...might wanna think BEFORE using pronouns denoting gender. Pronouns are words that replace nouns...words like 'he'.

pearlthesquirrel
786
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pearlthesquirrel 12/04/11 - 01:24 pm
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First of all, props to my man
Unpublished

First of all, props to my man Shayne for stating that he is an agnostic - because in virtually any area south of the Mason-Dixon line that could be considered "career suicide". Because I consider myself a skeptnostic,(the combination of skeptic with agnostic making the blended portmanteau word - skeptnostic - oh, I'm so clever!), I agree with the Shaynester wholeheartedly. But let's be honest and call a spade a spade - Christmas (or whatever you want to call it) is absolutely crass commercialization from corporate America at it's finest. I've barely put away the Snickers bars from Halloween and here comes the Christmas (again, whatever you want to call it) tsunami tidal-wave. I'll admit, I'm not that big on Christmas (once again!) myself because I don't consider myself to be a phony. What I mean is this: I don't treat people like crap eleven months of the year and then plaster on a false face for that last month of the year - that's just not me. But, as always, here come's the religious fight at the end of the year.....I mean, what says "unity" or "togetherness" more than the religious telling you all about the meaning of CHRISTmas. What I do know is this: atheists, agnostics, skeptics, etc. know there "religious rights" much better than the religious do. The religious just think they have the right to put religious artifacts (a.k.a. The Ten Commandments) in prominent public places - and you just can't do that - PERIOD! You see, what the "religious majority" (and don't tell me the religious aren't a majority in this country) don't understand is what Michael Shermer said in his book Why People Believe Weird Things: Being tolerant when you are in the majority means you have a greater chance of being tolerated when you are in the minority. Skeptnostic and damn proud..........peace out!

allhans
23688
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allhans 12/04/11 - 02:01 pm
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Some folks like the dark

Some folks like the dark side, but for me and mine we will take the light.

Bizkit
31545
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Bizkit 12/04/11 - 02:15 pm
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Think about the history of

Think about the history of America. Founded by peoples seeking religious freedom, the Irish (mostly catholic) came during the Potato famine, and even now immigrants from Mexico (mostly catholic). Almost all the founders documents mention God Now for the development of government they didn't want a theocracy, but the basic principal of Christianity is man is sinful so they created a govt with balance to offset human nature. The author of the article must have forgotten the three Great Awakenings that have occured in this country. During most of my early life , whether you were a Christian or not, most people acted along the lines of Christian principals and most neighborhoods were the same in raising the kids, etc. Since the 1970's Christianity has been waning-mainly because our youth are now indoctrinated in college against any theology. I experienced the same but I was already an atheist and remained so till my late 40s. I remember laughing at the folly of all religions, and I also remember teaching in college indoctrinating more youth to the myth, folly and ignorance of any religion. Having grown up in the Bible belt it never bothered me or offended me but I really believed it all to be folly and was amused (and generally believed a bunch of losers who feel so guilty about being such a screw up they needed to ease their conscience). I guess now I would say I was wrong, and religions do have a role in human health and psychology, history (although not always positive) and culture. Actually came to this belief studying evolution and memes. I see a political correctness to diminish what has historically been (80%) the dominant religion so other beliefs can be accepted. This is a strategy of discriminating so you don't discriminate, which is inane. I don't have a problem with other beliefs or disbelief but as a country we need to appreciate that all people want to celebrate their beliefs and give room and make room for such beliefs. Christmas is a holiday celebrating the birth of Christ to call it anything else is ridiculous. Should muslims change Ramadan or Jews Hannukah because of some political correctness-I think not. It is sad when America founded on principals of freedom are diminishing freedoms.

Iwannakno
1533
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Iwannakno 12/04/11 - 02:31 pm
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Christians seem to think that
Unpublished

Christians seem to think that only their religion should be represented. They would have a cow if a judge hung quotes from the Koran in a government building or if they had to swear to tell the truth on the Koran. Freedom of religion means freedom from religion. You have the right to worship whatever mythical being you like. You do not have the right to force that on the rest of the tax paying citizens.

Bizkit
31545
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Bizkit 12/04/11 - 02:45 pm
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Iwannakno. "Freedom of

Iwannakno. "Freedom of religion means freedom from religion". That is a non sequitur. Freedom of religon means freedom of religion-plain and simple. all Americans have the right to their religion or lack thereof. The fact that Christian sayings, etc. are so prominent is because the Christian faith has been the dominate faith, but these saying do not dictate people believe a particular relgion. "All men are created equal" is a secular statement-not a Christian one (christians emphasize all men aren't created equal). In God we trust is a US goverment motto (since 1956) but it doesn't signify any particular religion just a belief in a god. E pluribus unum is unofficial meaning out of many, one. Who knows in 2020 the motto could be muslim or hindu because of migration and gene flow.

bjphysics
36
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bjphysics 12/04/11 - 03:05 pm
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My religion is celebrated

My religion is celebrated during the holidays but only in practice not in word; commercial, corporate, and governmental recognition is implicit but not explicit.

Chillen
17
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Chillen 12/04/11 - 03:13 pm
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There is a change afoot. For

There is a change afoot. For the last decade, people who work in large corporations have always said "happy holidays". This year, I'm hearing about 50% "happy holidays" and 50% "Merry Christmas".

People are fed up with political correctness. The tide she is a turnin'.

harley_52
23459
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harley_52 12/04/11 - 03:20 pm
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It happens every year. Just

It happens every year.

Just after Thanksgiving we start hearing from all the atheists, agnostics, and this year even "skeptnostics" coming up with all their reasons for not liking Christmas. They object to the use of the word "Christ" as part of it, they don't want to see any religion stuffed down their throats, they think they've found some Constitutional bar, they abhor the tyranny of the majority, or some such invented reason really intended to show how "independent," or how "smart," or how "cool" they are compared to the rest of us rabble trash that are actually so bold as to believe in God and wish to celebrate Christ's birth on Christmas.

Sargebaby
4693
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Sargebaby 12/04/11 - 04:05 pm
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I'm happy to be among the

I'm happy to be among the majority of people who profess Christianity in this country! Yep, the numbers are still in our favor. So as far as the ranter is concerned, he is just spitting against the wind!

Iwannakno
1533
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Iwannakno 12/04/11 - 04:13 pm
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No it means I don't have to
Unpublished

No it means I don't have to believe what the majority tries to force on others. It also means I shouldn't have to put up with christian displays in government buildings. Just because the majority of the country are of the christian faith doesn't mean you can cram your beliefs down everyone else's throats. I choose to believe what I want to believe and do not dictate to others what they should believe. It really gets old being attacked because of it. Seems to me more christians attack non believers stance than the other way around. All you have to do is read the posts on any religious article. Seems the judge not lest ye be judged part is overlooked...a lot.

carcraft
25948
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carcraft 12/04/11 - 04:28 pm
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I feel sorry for the atheist,

I feel sorry for the atheist, skeptics and agnostics that have never experianced the life changing power of love, grace, forgiveness and acceptance one can experiance in knowing Jesus Christ as savior, "but to them that parish the cross of Christ is foolishness" that was written about two thousand years ago so there really isn't anything new under the sun!

Bizkit
31545
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Bizkit 12/04/11 - 05:22 pm
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Iwannokno but aren't you

Iwannokno but aren't you doing the same ramming your beliefs down everyone elses throats by not allowing others to express their first amendment rights. If there were no celebrations of any faith then you would have your paradise and others their hell. Seems fascist. Why not let all religions have their expressons and you have yours. Why are you afraid of any faith. I was an atheist for over 40 years and absolutely NO religion had any impact on me during that time. Seems childish. I can't have my way so no one else can either. Nobody is cramming anything down your throat-remember the govt prevents having a govt religion not the expression of a reiligion.The govt isn't forcing you to a religion. Everyone has the right and choice of their own.
What offends me about peoples opinions of homosexuality is they are being repressed by the govt trying to make it a hate crime to express an opinion contrary. I don't care what a persons opinioin is on the subject but I do care that because of political correctness no one can express their opinion. Why not rid the Black Panthers and KKK while at it. After all both are racist organizations that many find offensive. Geez. Freedom means the right to express an opinion no matter how offensive another individual would find offensive. You find religious holidays offensive and you have a right to that opinion but you don't have a right to repress that offense. Lastly, you shouldn't judge the religion by the people who believe in it-the reason they believe in it is they've already admitted they are morally corupt, wrong, a sinner, unethical, and evil. They come to the faith to change, which just like Obama says "takes time" hee,hee,hee.

desertcat6
1140
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desertcat6 12/04/11 - 05:16 pm
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0
Merry Christmas. My family

Merry Christmas. My family celebrates the day as the birth of Christ - historically acurate or not. Other religons and the faithless can do as they choose, and I will use my freedom of speech to let non-christians know that they too can be saved. God bless you.

Iwannakno
1533
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Iwannakno 12/04/11 - 05:30 pm
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No, I don't want "I don't
Unpublished

No, I don't want "I don't believe in Christianity" signs posted and I don't bash people for their beliefs. The government allowing religious displays only depicting ONE religion is cramming it down everyone's throats. I will say it again since you obviously missed it. I DON'T CARE WHAT YOU BELIEVE!!! I also don't care what you display on your property and this discussion has nothing to do with the KKK no idea where you got that stretch from.

Willow Bailey
20580
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Willow Bailey 12/04/11 - 05:36 pm
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I think (they) are finally

I think (they) are finally correct. There should be no more Merry Christmas. How about, Happy Birthday, Dear Lord & Savior!!

Bizkit
31545
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Bizkit 12/04/11 - 05:50 pm
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But we aren't talking about

But we aren't talking about the govt displaying religion just citizens celebrating a holiday of their faith. If the govt doesn't allow individuals the right of religious freedom and religious displays (Christmas, Hannukah, etc) then they've broken constitutional law. The govt doesn't allow nativity scenes etc on govt property, or at least when it does show up it is quickly closed down. The govt shouldn 't have any say about any religious display of any kind on anything but govt property. No one is cramming one religion down anyones throat. Americans have the right to express any religion, and at present christianity is still the dominant faith ,but say in another decade it maybe Ramadan or some other celebration. Who knows? That is what religious freedom is about.

allhans
23688
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allhans 12/04/11 - 05:55 pm
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Willow Bailey.. I like that.

Willow Bailey.. I like that. That would leave no doubt as to what we are celebrating. Nothing commercial, only the truth.

Bizkit
31545
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Bizkit 12/04/11 - 06:00 pm
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Now there are historic

Now there are historic buildings like the Supreme Court building, etc. with the ten commandments or some mention of God. But if aliens from another planet were to arrive and examine these facts they would assume the country was Jewish because they are all Old Testament-Book of Moses and there is no mention of Jesus Christ. Christ came and addressed every commandment and raise the bar on every single one-basically usurping the Old testament with a new covenant. The Ten commandments are for Jews as Christians are held to an even higher accounting.Christians don't even interpret the old testament as judaism does. God's word is supposed to be written on Christians heart not a stone tablet as in Old Testament judaism. Interesting eh?? Well for that matter the aliens may suppose the people could be muslim too. The Old Testament is the seed of Judaism and Islam.

pearlthesquirrel
786
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pearlthesquirrel 12/04/11 - 06:33 pm
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WOW - my eyes must be going
Unpublished

WOW - my eyes must be going bad because I looked at my previous post and I did NOT see anything saying I did NOT like Christmas - that's an interesting take. Hmmm, ad hominem attacks, circular reasoning, strawman arguments, and well, just plain old mangling someone elses words are just part of the religious repertoire. But let's set the record straight - the agnostics and the religious think very differently. I would like to explain the differences but, I think some YouTube videos can do a better job.
If you're agnostic, please go to YouTube and in the search box type in : Science saved my soul - it is a 14:59 video that maybe, sort of, kind of, explains how I look at my existence - [Pay attention at the 4:10 to 5:00 minute mark...AND... the last two or three minutes is chilling - when the music starts playing and that takes you to the end the video). And then on the other side of the coin is the religious thought process - go to YouTube and type in the word: NephilimFree - you should get a list of videos so, look for the one titled Water on the Moon - The Loon and the Moon (Part 1)...that's NOT a made up title - that's the actual title for this video. Enjoy the next 25 minutes of your life. I'm pearlthesquirrel and just remember this: Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while !!!!!!! Or, as Ric Flair would say : Whoooooooooooooooo !!!!

Marlee
0
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Marlee 12/04/11 - 06:36 pm
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"The exact date of Christ's

"The exact date of Christ's birth is not known. The early Christians did NOT celebrate His birth, because they considered the celebration of anyone's birth to be a pagan custom."

Christians being selfish and assuming that the day is theirs.. It's not, get over it. Everyone can celebrate they way they wish and you have no right to shove your beliefs down anyone else's throat..

Merry Christmas (from an atheist, and knows that there is no "War on Christmas".. You crazy Pagans)

allhans
23688
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allhans 12/04/11 - 06:48 pm
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Marlee..Is the last 3 words

Marlee..Is the last 3 words in the bracketed sentence referring to you or some one else?

Sargebaby
4693
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Sargebaby 12/04/11 - 06:49 pm
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Iwannakno, this discussion

Iwannakno, this discussion surfaces about four times a year, maybe more! You have your opinion, so you'll have to live with it! There is no such thing in our Constitution as "freedom "from" religion." Look it up, I'm not doing the leg-work for a non-believer. I wouldn't want to be accused of "forcing" my Religion on you, or anyone!

Christianity is a choice, my friend, it cannot be "forced," as you state, on anyone. You either accept, or reject! That's the choice! Choose wisely, or choose poorly, I would rather believe and find out that I was wrong, than not believe and find out that Almighty God is real! That's my choice, and I'm not forcing anyone to do as I do!

Sargebaby
4693
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Sargebaby 12/04/11 - 06:54 pm
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Goodness, Pearl, a video

Goodness, Pearl, a video convinced you? Well a 2000+ year old bunch of books did all the convincing I'll ever need.

Willow Bailey
20580
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Willow Bailey 12/04/11 - 07:06 pm
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Merry Christmas to you

Merry Christmas to you pearl.
Here's one for you. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Jr-2eyRtV4

Sargebaby
4693
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Sargebaby 12/04/11 - 07:22 pm
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Bizkit, thank you for your

Bizkit, thank you for your 1:15.

Iwannakno
1533
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Iwannakno 12/04/11 - 07:29 pm
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I would think the sheeple are
Unpublished

I would think the sheeple are the ones that follow a mythical grandfatherly figure that has no power except in their minds.

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