Church shouldn’t condone homosexuality

  • Follow Letters

Is the church movement to accept openly homosexual actions as normal an attempt to show love for all people regardless of what they do? If so, I believe the church is on the wrong path.

As a Presbyterian, I am deeply disappointed that the Presbyterian Church USA recently followed that path.

The Holy Bible speaks very harshly of homosexual sin. In the Old Testament, it is called "a detestable sin" (Leviticus 18:22, New Living Translation). In I Corinthians 6:9-10, Paul states that homosexuals, as well as many others, will not have a share in the kingdom of God. In Romans 1:18-32, he says that God abandoned people who push truth away from themselves. He "abandoned them to their shameful desires," and "as a result they did vile and degrading things with each other's bodies." The final verse says that "worse yet, they encourage others to do them too."

Were Moses and Paul wrong?

Is the church encouraging homosexuals to openly continue their sinful practices? Is asking a minister to be married to the opposite sex or to remain chaste too much? Perhaps I misread the article "Path cleared for gay clergy" (The Augusta Chronicle, May 11). Does "to submit joyfully to the Lordship of Jesus Christ in all aspects of life" mean the same thing?

Christians are to love everyone, even our enemies. That includes murderers, drunkards, thieves and liars, but would anyone encourage them to continue their destructive ways? To show true love for people, one should encourage them to seek forgiveness from God and try to lead a life as Jesus showed us.

Perhaps homosexual marriage and military service can be construed as civil liberties - but ordained Christian clergy? No. Nothing granted by man can remove sin.

Ralph Cauble
Martinez

Comments (56)

Add comment
ADVISORY: Users are solely responsible for opinions they post here and for following agreed-upon rules of civility. Posts and comments do not reflect the views of this site. Posts and comments are automatically checked for inappropriate language, but readers might find some comments offensive or inaccurate. If you believe a comment violates our rules, click the "Flag as offensive" link below the comment.
grouse
1580
Points
grouse 08/08/11 - 10:30 pm
0
0

Perhaps the gentleman should

Unpublished

Perhaps the gentleman should read the preceding and following versions of Leviticus and ask himself, does he follow these commandments. Perhaps, too, he should read the full verse of Corinthians: "Or do you not know that wrongdoers will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: Neither the sexually immoral nor idolaters nor adulterers nor men who have sex with men nor thieves nor the greedy nor drunkards nor slanderers nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God." That covers a lot more ground than just homosexuality. Adulterers certainly have no problem getting married in church. BTW, Christ was silent on the subject.

corgimom
19199
Points
corgimom 08/08/11 - 10:35 pm
0
0

I don't worry for one minute

I don't worry for one minute if a minister is homosexual or heterosexual, married or single.

Why would I? Who would?

howcanweknow
2306
Points
howcanweknow 08/08/11 - 10:55 pm
0
0

OK. For the 1000th time....

OK. For the 1000th time.... We DO NOT know that Christ was silent on any subject. The Gospel accounts are not exhaustive of every teaching Jesus gave. They openly admit that. So, we do not know that Christ never had anything say about homosexualty. Think before you make silly statements, people.

What we do have are the Epistles written by Jesus' apostles, and those are Christ's teachings just as well. Homosexuality is condemned as a sin there. You can't deny that, as the letter states.

Who would worry if a minister is homosexual? The "minister" had better worry. He/She (!) is in direct violation of the Bible they pretend to teach and defend. A "homosexual Christian minister" is a complete oxymoron.

You can disagree with the Bible. That is your right. But, don't twist the words to promote a personal agenda. Just admit you believe God is wrong and you are right.

PCnomo
1
Points
PCnomo 08/09/11 - 12:21 am
0
0

HCWK says:- The gospel

HCWK says:- The gospel accounts are not exhaustive of every teaching Jesus gave, They freely admit that.
Then perhaps churches should stop claiming their way is the only way. Maybe followers should refrain from claiming they know the truth and witnessing to others with an insufficient understanding of the message. After all, if I only have half a textbook, it is highly unlikely I will have enough information to attempt to teach the subject to others.

HCWK also says:- So, we do not know Christ never had anything to say about homosexuality.
That would be a correct statement if the previous claim of the gospels not being exhaustive of Jesus' teachings is also correct. Therefore, it is at least possible he said “ Don't concern yourself with what others are doing, pay attention only to what you are doing as my message to you is a purely personal one” and that verse just didn't make it into the gospels we have today. However, Jesus did say 'Love thy neighbor as thyself.' and I notice he did not make that commandment conditional by adding “ unless your neighbor happens to be homosexual, then you may despise and revile him at every opportunity to avoid having to look at your own failings.”

HCWK further says:- Just admit you believe God is wrong and you are right.
While it is usually advantageous to claim the support of a big name sponsor, it would be difficult for thinking people to take that claim seriously after I have just stated that I don't know what Jesus said and the scriptures are not a complete picture of his teaching.

But, I may be wrong.

AndrewLafa
27
Points
AndrewLafa 08/09/11 - 03:17 am
0
0

The "holy" bible thinks it's

The "holy" bible thinks it's a good idea to cut off your hand or pluck out your eyes if you commit adultery. Think about this. If this were followed 3/4 of the population in the CSRA would be blind or handless.

My point is that there's a lot of completely idiotic things in the bible, and it shouldn't be taken too seriously.

Fundamental_Arminian
1725
Points
Fundamental_Arminian 08/09/11 - 03:56 am
0
0

"BTW, Christ was silent on

"BTW, Christ was silent on the subject [homosexuality]" (Grouse).

Christ taught, "... Until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass away from the Law until all is accomplished" (Matthew 5:18 English Standard Version). He added, ".. It is easier for heaven and earth to pass away than for one dot of the Law to become void" (Luke 16:17 ESV).

Since the Law prohibits homosexuality as Mr. Cauble proves with Leviticus 18:22, why should anyone assume that Christ disagreed with what the Law said about homosexuality?

If the writers Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John do not document any teaching by Christ concerning homosexuality, the reason may be that the Jewish people of his day were not in error about that sin. Where they erred about other sins, he certainly rebuked them.

When the Gospel was spread among Gentiles who didn't know the Law, the apostle Paul and others had to clear up any confusion about whether homosexuality was sinful.

Fundamental_Arminian
1725
Points
Fundamental_Arminian 08/09/11 - 04:18 am
0
0

"As a Presbyterian, I am

"As a Presbyterian, I am deeply disappointed that the Presbyterian Church USA recently followed that path" (Ralph Cauble).

If Presbyterianism is for you, why not switch from the PCUSA to the Presbyterian Church in America? The PCA hasn't abandoned the Bible's teachings on sin and righteousness.

carcraft
20640
Points
carcraft 08/09/11 - 04:27 am
0
0

Ralph, I know your pain and

Ralph, I know your pain and discomfort with where your Church (Presbyterian Church USA) is headed. I am an Episcoplian and since they started abondoning the truth of scripture we have lost about 1/3 of our membership, we have a Presiding Bishop with paper thin credentials who is wasting millions of dollars and has the theological depth of a mud puddle. Now the leaders are trying to define what constitutes a "christian homosexual marriage" . Some of thier pronouncements have been humorous, to say the least, such as "we expect these releationships to fallow in the christian tradition". Your church will be torn apart because the shepherds (leaders) have abandon the flock to run after the short term pleasures of the flesh and the evil one will scatter you!

carcraft
20640
Points
carcraft 08/09/11 - 04:32 am
0
0

In all my reading of

In all my reading of scripture I can find no place where homosexuality or homosexuals are positivily portrayed. Prostitutes have some positive press, a thief hanging on a cross gets it, an adultress about to be stone is saved. The nation of Isreal wins a difficult battle because of a prostitute. One of Jesus forbears is born because a women plays a prostitute and committes adultry with her father in law (the story of Perz). Not one positive image of a homosexual in scripture!

Dixieman
10350
Points
Dixieman 08/09/11 - 06:21 am
0
0

Join a different church.

Join a different church.

blues550
344
Points
blues550 08/09/11 - 06:36 am
0
0

"Judge not". My 2 favorite

Unpublished

"Judge not". My 2 favorite words in The Bible.

As a very far to the right Episcopalian I do not condone this lifestyle. As a Christian I welcome all of God's people - without prejudice - into The Church.

burninater
6783
Points
burninater 08/09/11 - 07:07 am
0
0

Living in the South has

Living in the South has taught me that religion is a waste of perfectly good faith.

Granddaddy John
101
Points
Granddaddy John 08/09/11 - 07:47 am
0
0

God said, That a man is not

Unpublished

God said, That a man is not to lay with another man as he would lay with a woman.Good enough for me.

allhans
21928
Points
allhans 08/09/11 - 08:12 am
0
0

I agree with Mr. Cauble. You

I agree with Mr. Cauble. You can't keep sin from entering your house of worship, but neither do you invite it in.

FalseHopeLooseChange
5
Points
FalseHopeLooseChange 08/09/11 - 08:45 am
0
0

If you think God is gonna

If you think God is gonna just forgive you for homosexuality and abortion of the unborn , and then welcome you to heaven with open arms, you just may be eternally wrong.

I believe He is a forgiving God, and I also believe He'll forgive you for these sins -- but as a very vengeful God, He's going to immediately send your sorry butt to Hell to pay the consequences. But that's just my belief...... You do what you gotta do, and I'm sure God will do what He has to do.

augusta citizen
7582
Points
augusta citizen 08/09/11 - 08:54 am
0
0

Good and to the point comment

Good and to the point comment allhans.

PCnomo
1
Points
PCnomo 08/09/11 - 08:56 am
0
0

?

?

InChristLove
21686
Points
InChristLove 08/09/11 - 09:11 am
0
0

The problem today (IMHO) is

The problem today (IMHO) is that we have lost the meaning of Love. Love is not a feeling but an action. When God calls us to love our neighbor he is talking about agape love, not eros love (or sexual love). I can love (agape) my neighbor as Christ has commanded me to without approving or accepting a certain type of behavior from them that are taught in His Holy Word to be sinful.

Also, the fact that there is forgiveness is often times discarded when we talk about the sin of homosexuality. The Bible does speak of homosexuals not entering heaven but we forget to continue reading where Paul says but by God's Grace there is forgiveness for sin. I have no problem with worshiping with homosexuals (as a matter of fact we have had some in our church) but we are also taught to correct our brothers and sisters when they sin. If a thief came to worship and continued to steal, if a murderer came to worship and continued to murder, if an adulterer came to worship and continued to commit adultery, it is commanded by God for the body of believers to pray for that person and lead him back on the path of righteousness....why is it so wrong to do the same for a homosexual who is sinning.

Blues550, please go back and do some more studying of God's Word so you will understand the meaning of "Judge not". This verse is referring to condemnation of man, not discernment. As believers we are called to judge what is righteous and what is not in order to follow God's leading and avoid worldly temptations.

Actually AndrewLafa, the scripture Matthew 5:29 reads "If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away. It is better for you to lose one part of your body than for your whole body to be thrown into hell."

If you are going to quote scripture, please understand the meaning and don't just pick and choose which part appears to validate your point of view. The scripture is true for it is better to loose a part of this earthly body if it causes you to sin "than to be thrown into the pit of hell for eternity". That's the part you left off. Your soul and where you will spend eternity is more important than a hand, foot, eye, etc.

InChristLove
21686
Points
InChristLove 08/09/11 - 09:17 am
0
0

FalseHopeLooseChange, you are

FalseHopeLooseChange, you are entitled to your belief but I'm sorry, it is not biblically based.

Hebrews 8:12 says "For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more."

When we sincerely ask for forgiveness, Christ forgives and remembers them no more. He is an angry God where unconfessed sin is concerned but he is also a loving and forgiving just God. Jesus died on the cross for our forgiveness and it's only based on one condition....and that is, we have to accept the gift in order to receive it.

Fundamental_Arminian
1725
Points
Fundamental_Arminian 08/09/11 - 09:40 am
0
0

"When we sincerely ask for

"When we sincerely ask for forgiveness, Christ forgives and remembers them no more. He is an angry God where unconfessed sin is concerned but he is also a loving and forgiving just God. Jesus died on the cross for our forgiveness and it's only based on one condition....and that is, we have to accept the gift in order to receive it" (ICL).

There's another condition: repentance. It goes hand in hand with the confession that Christ is Lord. If we don't do what Christ tells us, our confession of his Lordship is false, and we can't be saved with a false confession.

21 “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22 On that day many will say to me, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ 23 And then will I declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness’" (Matthew 7:21-23 English Standard Version).

InChristLove
21686
Points
InChristLove 08/09/11 - 09:57 am
0
0

Fundamental_Arminian, my

Fundamental_Arminian, my error. I assumed that most would understand that to sincerely ask for forgiveness, the act of repentance is a given and would automatically follow (if we are sincere). It goes hand in hand.

PCnomo
1
Points
PCnomo 08/09/11 - 10:03 am
0
0

MyFather15 says :- The word

MyFather15 says :- The word 'neighbor' is the same word as 'brother', which in the Greek means 'A like minded person. I don't believe the people talked about in this article are 'like minded' with me.

As I understand it, the hebrew for brother is 'ach' and for neighbor is a 'shachem'. As both have coresponding words in Greek, I am confused by your claim that they mean like-minded. But I will admit, it does look rather intellectual and studious when thrown out in such a superior manner, even if the claim has no basis in truth.

It is curious that those who usually hold to a literal interpretation of the bible can fall back on differences in Greek and Hebrew translations of a specific word when the literal word does not neatly fit with their preconceived ideas or prejudices.

The self-important and erroneous logic that only the like-minded are worthy of being treated equally then justifies the christian condemnation of others, believing them to by deficient and inferior because they choose not to think as I do whether they accept a different religious denomination or even none at all.

Actually, your idea, ( or the idea of your tri-lingual minister ) is shot to pieces by the bible itself. I refer to the parable of the good samaritan in Luke 10:36 when Jesus asks, "Which one was the neighbor of him that fell among theives? A samaritan was obviously not like minded in respect to religious beliefs but in that he showed compassion and mercy to the unlucky fellow he met on the road to Jerusalem.

Jane18
12331
Points
Jane18 08/09/11 - 10:45 am
0
0

PCnomo, you need to know that

PCnomo, you need to know that 'brother' is someone from the same tribes(12 tribes of Israel-Jacob), and 'neighbor' is someone not of those tribes,BUT,accepts and lives the same beliefs that JESUS taught. You probably don't know where you(nor your ancestors)actually migrated from, so be careful talking about things you know not of. And thank the LORD the samaritan was not likeminded concerning the priest and the levite, they did not do what they were supposed to. I believe they were either cowards or thought themselves too good to help! That discernment is just my opinion, kind of like people nowadays, don't you think?

iLove
626
Points
iLove 08/09/11 - 10:58 am
0
0

ADAM AND EVE!!! It is a GIVEN

Unpublished

ADAM AND EVE!!!

It is a GIVEN that God created Man for Woman and Woman for Man, Jesus didn't have to speak on it. . .it is A GIVEN FACT.

Old Testament was written for a specific people in a specific time.
New Testament spoke on "wrong sex" in Romans and other books.

No matter how the WORLD tries to CHANGE and BE GOD, they will not succeed.

The issue is that, MANY MANY MANY PEOPLE are worldy and not Godly. . . the Bible can't be fully understood with your NATURAL MIND. It takes the power of the Holy Spirit (God) to grant us full understanding.

What good can come from a society of homosexuals? Where will our children come from?

Why is sex so important to people?

iLove
626
Points
iLove 08/09/11 - 11:04 am
0
0

Any "church" that supports

Unpublished

Any "church" that supports homosexuality is going against Gods word. . . ."many false teachers".

God also said that WE ARE THE CHURCH, not some man made building. But, we as followers of Christ need to fellowship with people of the same beliefs.

Deception = Truth & Lies

There is some truth in the deception.

realitycheck09
307
Points
realitycheck09 08/09/11 - 11:40 am
0
0

I think Butters Stotch from

I think Butters Stotch from South Park said it best:

"My name is Butters, I'm 8 years old, I'm blood type O and I'm bi-curious! And even that's okay, because if I'm bi-curious and I'm somehow made from God, then I figure God might be a little bi-curious himself!"

carcraft
20640
Points
carcraft 08/09/11 - 11:58 am
0
0

We have always had sin and

We have always had sin and sinners in churchs. The differance today is that people want to celibrate the sin in church! "I am bi-curious..." The reason some people may be born to certain proclivities or desires is because the Bible tells us the world was broken when original sin entered into the world and has lead man into sin and degradation ever since, what bi-curios is experiancing is the result of sin and the degradation of God's creation..

dougk
3
Points
dougk 08/09/11 - 12:33 pm
0
0

is lousy spelling sinful?

Unpublished

is lousy spelling sinful?

commonsense-is-endangere
43
Points
commonsense-is-endangere 08/09/11 - 12:38 pm
0
0

Churches need to start doing

Churches need to start doing a lot of things like start paying taxes like the rest of us. They have been on this tax fiddle for far too long. Stop sucking the life out of a community.

InChristLove
21686
Points
InChristLove 08/09/11 - 12:39 pm
0
0

Thank you carcraft....very

Thank you carcraft....very well said. We were made in the image of God but due to sin entering the world most of us have no resembalance of God. It is only through the cleansing power of the blood of Jesus Christ and His mighty grace that we can be transformed back to what God intended us to be.

Back to Top

Loading...